Pulled Pork sandwhiches Using the New Sauce.

[Rich Parker]

Originally Posted by Spruce-Ridge-Smokers

Ok. Not being a smarta$$ here, but I am confused by this admonishment. With all due respect (so that this post doesn't vaporize), could you explain what you mean??

Thanks.

B.

If your post has nothing to do with the original post on the thread it is not on topic.

For the future if you have a question on how or why a thread is being moderated take it up by sending a PM to the moderators instead of furthering the discussion from the original point of the thread.

Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk

[Spruce-Ridge-Smokers]

Originally Posted by Rich Parker

If your post has nothing to do with the original post on the thread it is not on topic.

For the future if you have a question on how or why a thread is being moderated take it up by sending a PM to the moderators instead of furthering the discussion from the original point of the thread.

Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk

Well, Rich, I have to say, I absolutely think the world of you as a fierce, worthy competitor (and hopefully as a friend), and I am not looking for a fight or to pick on anyone in any way. But I will state clearly at this point, for all to hear, that if those are the new "rules", ya'all have fun with them, because I am done. If Mod discussions cannot happen in the open (barring some really inappropriate speech), I guess that this is not the playground for me (and perhaps some others). I fail to see why these posts were not considered "on topic", nor do I understand why all of a sudden (in my opinion) new boundaries are being imposed without the "rules" even being posted or discussed. The good news is that if the "offenders" such as myself all just go off and find something better to do, the forum traffic will be reduced by a good 75% and moderating/deleting will become a considerably easier task for all with the power to do so.

Really?

See ya.

B.

[Rich Parker]

Originally Posted by Spruce-Ridge-Smokers

Well, Rich, I have to say, I absolutely think the world of you as a fierce, worthy competitor (and hopefully as a friend), and I am not looking for a fight or to pick on anyone in any way. But I will state clearly at this point, for all to hear, that if those are the new "rules", ya'all have fun with them, because I am done. If Mod discussions cannot happen in the open (barring some really inappropriate speech), I guess that this is not the playground for me (and perhaps some others). I fail to see why these posts were not considered "on topic", nor do I understand why all of a sudden (in my opinion) new boundaries are being imposed without the "rules" even being posted or discussed. The good news is that if the "offenders" such as myself all just go off and find something better to do, the forum traffic will be reduced by a good 75% and moderating/deleting will become a considerably easier task for all with the power to do so.

Really?

See ya.

B.

I understand Brian and don't think our friendship will be effected by a conversation on the forum.

I don't have a problem answering a question from you, Mike R., or Big Stick on the forum but posting the question in a thread that is already derailing is adding to the problem. If you don't want to send a PM than you can post a new thread in the Cyber Bar, and I would happily answer but debating whether who is right is not going to happen.

In this thread, you posted twice and each time said either you aren't trying to be a smarta$$ or trying to pick a fight but then you are questioning me while I am trying to keep the thread on topic which can easily be perceived as you picking a fight while a moderator is trying to "do their job". I personally know you and don't think that is what you were trying to accomplish, but I know you are more than capable of handling it in a different and better manner.

To answer your question on new "rules" there are no new "rules" being implied here, but Mike is working on some forum rules because there are folks out there that don't understand forum etiquette. Most of the etiquette is common sense but it also helps people understand the roles.

Part of a moderators job is to make sure forum threads "stay the course" and while there is wiggle room given it is a moderators job if they see a thread going off topic to steer it back on to topic.

In this thread, it was quite obvious that a thread that was last posted on more than a month ago was resurrected and started to quickly veer from the topic and that is why i posted for people to please stay on topic. Nobody's post was modified or deleted for violating any old rules or perceived new rules just a simple request to stay on topic.

This forum is very relaxed in moderating and in most cases lets the threads go in there own direction but when people are complaining and reporting posts we have to try and get things back in line. I am a member on several bbq forums and don't think you are going to find one that will allow it. Most would just delete your posts and not answer when questioning a moderator in public because you are undermining their authority or position on the forum. Other forums when people threaten to leave get helped out the door.

Just so you know every person that complains or threatens to leave a forum there is usually at least one member that starts posting because they're gone, so i don't think anyone is going to be worried about traffic.

Now I don't want to see you leave the forum but if you still feel the need to after reading this I personally would understand.

[spydermike72]

Ok, just my .02 and then we can all move on. The rules are being looked at by the BOD at this moment. They are not anything you have not seen before so no one will be surprised.

Now let's get back on topic and discuss the Pulled Pork sandwiches with Derek's new sauce...

[Spruce-Ridge-Smokers]

Originally Posted by Rich Parker

I understand Brian and don't think our friendship will be effected by a conversation on the forum.

I don't have a problem answering a question from you, Mike R., or Big Stick on the forum but posting the question in a thread that is already derailing is adding to the problem. If you don't want to send a PM than you can post a new thread in the Cyber Bar, and I would happily answer but debating whether who is right is not going to happen.

In this thread, you posted twice and each time said either you aren't trying to be a smarta$$ or trying to pick a fight but then you are questioning me while I am trying to keep the thread on topic which can easily be perceived as you picking a fight while a moderator is trying to "do their job". I personally know you and don't think that is what you were trying to accomplish, but I know you are more than capable of handling it in a different and better manner.

To answer your question on new "rules" there are no new "rules" being implied here, but Mike is working on some forum rules because there are folks out there that don't understand forum etiquette. Most of the etiquette is common sense but it also helps people understand the roles.

Part of a moderators job is to make sure forum threads "stay the course" and while there is wiggle room given it is a moderators job if they see a thread going off topic to steer it back on to topic.

In this thread, it was quite obvious that a thread that was last posted on more than a month ago was resurrected and started to quickly veer from the topic and that is why i posted for people to please stay on topic. Nobody's post was modified or deleted for violating any old rules or perceived new rules just a simple request to stay on topic.

This forum is very relaxed in moderating and in most cases lets the threads go in there own direction but when people are complaining and reporting posts we have to try and get things back in line. I am a member on several bbq forums and don't think you are going to find one that will allow it. Most would just delete your posts and not answer when questioning a moderator in public because you are undermining their authority or position on the forum. Other forums when people threaten to leave get helped out the door.

Just so you know every person that complains or threatens to leave a forum there is usually at least one member that starts posting because they're gone, so i don't think anyone is going to be worried about traffic.

Now I don't want to see you leave the forum but if you still feel the need to after reading this I personally would understand.

A most eloquent response; thank you Rich.

Having been around the forum for a while now, I guess I am somewhat taken aback by what I at least perceive to be a change in policy regarding "staying on topic". The admins/moderators run the sandbox and are obviously free to impose any strictures that they feel are appropriate, but I think that if you are going to be more insistent that threads stay very true to the root post, that needs to be clearly stated (which you have now done). I have re-read the entire thread about six times now and I have to admit that I still do not understand why anyone would take particular exception to the posts that were made. Over the past couple of years, I have watched threads on this forum veer wildly off-topic without any moderator ever saying word one. I am not saying that it was right, that was simply the way things were. That is why it comes as a surprise to me to have such "drift" become perceived recently as some sort of affront.

One of the reasons I took exception to your post was that when members were in my view simply asking "why", the answer seemed to be a little of "because I said so" rather than a genuine explanation (again; you have now provided that). In addition, the part about PMing seemed to be saying "and if you don't like it, it must be discussed in private". I fully appreciate that mods do not wish to be pulled into a public debate which could undermine their authority, but I believe a forum is all about openess, and I simply do not feel that having a moderator's actions always hidden behind the PM "wall" is appropriate. It is certainly understandable that you do not want a discussion of moderation to "blow up" inside of a thread, and your suggestion of opening a different thread is a good one. Perhaps you could go us all one better and open up a section entitled "Moderators Lounge" or something like that where the mods could provide a little more color as to their concerns with various threads/posts. That way we could all better understand what some of us perceive to be "new" rules (remember; perception is reality).

As for me leaving the forum, I will be happy to if asked. Participation in the forum is obviously not necessary for cooking comps. I guess my current feeling is that I will make a greater effort to use the forum to obtain and coordinate information on comps and potlucks, and leave my nose out of the other topics. Perhaps that way the mods can spend less time scrubbing threads and more time "focusing" on BBQ.

Thanks for listening Rich.

And now, as Mike said, back to Derek's pulled pork sammies with sauce and poo.

B.

[Rich Parker]

Originally Posted by Spruce-Ridge-Smokers

A most eloquent response; thank you Rich.

Having been around the forum for a while now, I guess I am somewhat taken aback by what I at least perceive to be a change in policy regarding "staying on topic". The admins/moderators run the sandbox and are obviously free to impose any strictures that they feel are appropriate, but I think that if you are going to be more insistent that threads stay very true to the root post, that needs to be clearly stated (which you have now done). I have re-read the entire thread about six times now and I have to admit that I still do not understand why anyone would take particular exception to the posts that were made. Over the past couple of years, I have watched threads on this forum veer wildly off-topic without any moderator ever saying word one. I am not saying that it was right, that was simply the way things were. That is why it comes as a surprise to me to have such "drift" become perceived recently as some sort of affront.

One of the reasons I took exception to your post was that when members were in my view simply asking "why", the answer seemed to be a little of "because I said so" rather than a genuine explanation (again; you have now provided that). In addition, the part about PMing seemed to be saying "and if you don't like it, it must be discussed in private". I fully appreciate that mods do not wish to be pulled into a public debate which could undermine their authority, but I believe a forum is all about openess, and I simply do not feel that having a moderator's actions always hidden behind the PM "wall" is appropriate. It is certainly understandable that you do not want a discussion of moderation to "blow up" inside of a thread, and your suggestion of opening a different thread is a good one. Perhaps you could go us all one better and open up a section entitled "Moderators Lounge" or something like that where the mods could provide a little more color as to their concerns with various threads/posts. That way we could all better understand what some of us perceive to be "new" rules (remember; perception is reality).

It is true, I definitely use the "staying on topic" post more than Bubba and Mike. It is my opinion though that there has been an increased amount of negativity and disrespectful posts on the forum and to try and steer those threads from being like that I personally look at them with more scrutiny. I have asked people nicely to not participate in these threads when they start to derail but it is like a train wreck and everybody wants to be there and watch and give there own opinion.

That said if you create a thread about something and you and others take it way off topic while being respectful, I will be right there with you having a good time and those are probably the posts you are remembering a while back. These threads still happen today they just aren't the most recent train wreck threads.

Originally Posted by Spruce-Ridge-Smokers

I guess my current feeling is that I will make a greater effort to use the forum to obtain and coordinate information on comps and potlucks, and leave my nose out of the other topics. Perhaps that way the mods can spend less time scrubbing threads and more time "focusing" on BBQ.

Even though using the forum for coordinating info on comps and potlucks is a good thing, I wish some of our more experience members (you included ) would participate in the threads where people are asking for advice or opinions such as the thread last night about brisket problems and ignore these threads when they start to derail.

This forum has a lot of successful backyard cooks, award winning competition cooks, experienced certified judges, and successful caterers and it would be nice if we could get more respectful and non judgmental sharing of information on the forum about these topics to promote bbq and all aspects of outdoor cooking.

[Big Stick]

"This forum has a lot of successful backyard cooks, award winning competition cooks, experienced certified judges, and successful caterers and it would be nice if we could get more respectful and non judgmental sharing of information on the forum about these topics to promote bbq and all aspects of outdoor cooking. "

I find it interesting that you mention this. Because it seems as though when it comes to constructive criticism, there may be a poster or 2 who seem to take it the wrong way, and are likely the ones reporting posts for abuse, and loading up your boxes with complaints, and probably do it on a regular basis. If ones skin isn't thick enough to take a bit of heat over a comment made about putting poo on a sandwich, perhaps the issue is more with the one who made the comment itself, instead of the ones responding to it. Just my pair of lincolns.

[Rich Parker]

Originally Posted by Big Stick

"This forum has a lot of successful backyard cooks, award winning competition cooks, experienced certified judges, and successful caterers and it would be nice if we could get more respectful and non judgmental sharing of information on the forum about these topics to promote bbq and all aspects of outdoor cooking. "

I find it interesting that you mention this. Because it seems as though when it comes to constructive criticism, there may be a poster or 2 who seem to take it the wrong way, and are likely the ones reporting posts for abuse, and loading up your boxes with complaints, and probably do it on a regular basis. If ones skin isn't thick enough to take a bit of heat over a comment made about putting poo on a sandwich, perhaps the issue is more with the one who made the comment itself, instead of the ones responding to it. Just my pair of lincolns.

There definitely is an issue with people taking criticism the wrong way but there is just as much of a problem with how people are giving the criticism and why i put respectful and non judgmental in my post above.

Just to pick on you for a minute and not that I personally think you are using this term in this manner but you like to use the word "son" in your posts and to some people that is a derogatory word implying inferiority. Even though, you believe you are giving constructive criticism the person you are giving it to might take it wrong because of the use of it.

My point is that some people just don't "click" and it when it happens just don't respond to that person's threads, posts, or questions and just ignore them. It will make life easier for everyone.

[Big Stick]

Originally Posted by Rich Parker

There definitely is an issue with people taking criticism the wrong way but there is just as much of a problem with how people are giving the criticism and why i put respectful and non judgmental in my post above.

I agree with that whole heartedly.

Just to pick on you for a minute and not that I personally think you are using this term in this manner but you like to use the word "son" in your posts and to some people that is a derogatory word implying inferiority. Even though, you believe you are giving constructive criticism the person you are giving it to might take it wrong because of the use of it.

If somebody actually reported me for calling them "son", and you actually felt that it needed to be addressed as a moderator, you are really making a lot of work for yourself and other mods. Parenting is best left to parents, not mods on a webforum, IMHO.

My point is that some people just don't "click" and it when it happens just don't respond to that person's threads, posts, or questions and just ignore them. It will make life easier for everyone.

Well, I think it once again comes down to the individual reporting abuse. There is that old adage about the ambient temperature in the kitchen, and what you are kind of saying is now everybody must tread lightly, so as to not risk offending someone, who won't actually tell you they are offended, but will ask that others take care of that for them. Sounds as though you are inviting much of this work upon yourself. Some folks need to grow a thicker skin..... Others need to let things just play out, and see where the chips fall....

[Rich Parker]

Originally Posted by Big Stick

If somebody actually reported me for calling them "son", and you actually felt that it needed to be addressed as a moderator, you are really making a lot of work for yourself and other mods. Parenting is best left to parents, not mods on a webforum, IMHO.

You should read what i wrote again because if we thought it would have needed to be moderated it would have been.

Originally Posted by Big Stick

Well, I think it once again comes down to the individual reporting abuse. There is that old adage about the ambient temperature in the kitchen, and what you are kind of saying is now everybody must tread lightly, so as to not risk offending someone, who won't actually tell you they are offended, but will ask that others take care of that for them. Sounds as though you are inviting much of this work upon yourself. Some folks need to grow a thicker skin..... Others need to let things just play out, and see where the chips fall....

No I am not kind of saying to tread lightly. Plain and simple if a member doesn't get along with another member they should ignore each other. We are all adults here and should be able to act as such.